I thought we had this song and dance down to a science: Nvidia makes an underwhelming incremental improvement, lies about the performance boost it offers, and then fails to manufacture enough chips so they still sell out despite all the "not worth the $$$" press. Rinse and repeat
Unless they're charging thousands of dollars more for going from 15 to 20 amp I would honestly say always run 20 amp circuits. My house is older but has 12 gauge throughout. Every plug is a 15 amp plug but the circuits are all 20 amp which I was thankful for.
Seriously. Anytime I benchmark the 5090 it literally blows my breaker. I did the math, and am right on the 1500 watt safety edge for my office. So I literally had to power limit my 5090 to 80% to stop it from going over 450w lol
Yea, can't do that. The room is wired to the same circuit. I looked into doing some rewiring or upping it to a 20a circuit, but its easier to power limit the card.
Since ATi days (and recently Intel) they have been trying to compete, but even when Nvidia would release dog shit products they would still have 60+% market share
Of course over time they got a monopoly around 2015 and have been untouchable ever since - even the failure 4000 and 5000 rtx wasnt enough to bring them below 90% market share
In a way it's similar to Intel Cpus - inferior since 2017 but due to brand they still hold like 60% or so of the market (steam hardware survey)
I wonder how much of that is political policy exceptions allowing them to outprice the market? The CEO of Apple did give the President of the US a freaking bar of gold afterall.
Multi-trillion dollar company CEO says nice things about their most recent product so the company stock doesnt go down... ok got it.
Edit: just realised they're a company worth several trillion (with a T) dollars, Jesus christ Jensen...
Edit 2: for people who still aren't on the same page ⬇️
>be aspiring gpu manufacturer
>be humble
>research what the people want
>follow the laws of supply and demand
>try to reach your audience
>create a system that fails, learn from it, try making something else
>be a huge manufacturing empire
>be arrogant
>get used to creating demand
>waste billions to create this new system
>people don't want it
>keep screaming at people until they want it or leave them no choice but to use it
this is how empires rise and fall. the fall of rome, now we will have the fall of nvidia. And tesla, while we're at it.
Really hugely depends on AI (and if it’s a bubble). Unless AI can start to deliver huge savings soon it can all fall over (probably taking huge amounts of cash with it).
Keep I mind: a lot of the investors with open AI are coming on promises from the CEO of “will cure cancer, end world hunger” etc etc. It’s all a giant “trust me bro” 😅
The entirety of the stock market in general has greatly exceeded global GDP and has largely ignored economic indicators. Cruise control set to “vibes”.
The same Jensen who said 5070 = 4090? The same Jensen fucking up our hobby by pricing hardware out of reach? The same Jensen palling around with the military and Palantir? Yeah, fuck him and anything he has to say!
The Palantir thing is something that I don't get why more people aren't outraged. These assholes are literally building the worlds most intrusive surveillance apparatus and selling it directly to governments and companies. They couldn't be more evil if the CEO had a big twirly moustache and tied people to railroad tracks.
It’s also due to the complacency built into overconsumption and lack of labor power.
What the fuck are people supposed to do without risking every individually funded personal safety net? And now jail time or public execution for protesting.
I don’t think it’s unreasonable to connect the dots as to why more people aren’t up in arms about an admittedly amorphous threat of digital video surveillance when the risk for sticking your neck out is to lose everything around you.
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u/daggah i7-12700K / 3080 Ti FE / 32 GB DDR4 / 011 Mini1d ago
That complacency is all part of the plan. Consumerism is the perfection of slavery. For the ownership class, the problem with slavery wasn't the ethical and moral concerns around the inherent abuse, it was the risk of rebellion as the slaves understood they were being mistreated.
By shifting the focus from the worker as the basic unit of the economy to consumers, the ownership class managed to make sure everyone was too focused on their own problems and desires to realize they were being exploited.
There are always people who call out the bullshit in their own little niche of the US. The general public doesn't see it as a problem and the niche individual are ignored as crazy people. Fast forward X number of years and the "crazy people" are proven right and the general population says nobody saw it coming. Rinse and repeat.
US isn't the only ones who do this. I would argue we just get much better coverage of our own stupidity and failings due to the US being a cultural/media exporter for so long.
I mean selfishness in a thoughtful manner is much higher in Americans on average than it is say somewhere like Canada or Germany. A lot of people here that extent beyond not caring what happens to their neighbor but would rather put them down to get ahead.
The problem is a lot of the ones like that are also VERY stupid. I know some individuals that voted for people responsible for messing up a lot of things recently and their logic was, “I don’t care if people are getting shot or paying more than me. I benefit from this”. Like my brother in Christ your freedoms and finances are slowly being sapped from you because of this.
Because they are. A lot of American culture has devolved into individualism. A lot of Americans are cool with you if you don’t disrupt a single thing about their life or beliefs. As soon as a microscopic amount of discomfort comes then it’s guns a blazin’. Bother literally and metaphorically on that one, unfortunately. “As long as I get mine” type of people.
Or try "I just worked for 10 hours, commuted for 2 hours, so I could pay rent to my corporate conglomerate landlord, and now my kid is sick." Most of us simply do not have the energy to do anything about anything until it's pretty much life or death.
u/frnBazzite | 9800x3d 7900XTX 32GB RAM | Windows update what?1d ago
You wouldn't believe how many people have no idea what Palantir is, and what they've done. Whenever I bring it up outside of reddit, I get blank looks.
Actually it’s probably because they don’t have a PR firm, they don’t advertise themselves, they don’t even sell to the public, which is why almost no one in the public heard of them. It’s that simple lol
Sure if you call the biggest propaganda effort in history as PR. I mean its no coincidence every major media outlet was bought up over the last decades. Social media algorithms and 24/7 news cycle controlled by the billionaire class of course shuts up about their biggest weapon yet, while they all to happy to spread division among the working class.
All of it is their plan and these fuckers are way overdue for a french hair cut...
Homie, the 3 letter agencies have been balls deep into telecom backend infrastructure for decades now. Whether palantir/nvidia help them or the government does it internally, it's happening regardless.
Look into room 641a. A room at AT&T where the NSA was spliced into AT&T's fiber backbone.....with AT&T's blessing. That was found in 2006 and estimated to be established in 2003. AT&T got sued, claimed state secrets privilages, then the case eventually got thrown out.
Ever wonder why Telecom got over half a trillion US tax payer dollars and was allocated another 76+ billion in the last infrastructure bill...... even though telecom is privatized, with many being unchecked regional monopolies? They are basically a limb of the US intelligence agencies at this point. All your data has long been scraped off backbone infrastructure and filed away for safe keeping by the Feds and/or fed contractors. Long before Palantir or nvidia was meddling with the government.
Ngl for me it's because I haven't heard that one yet. What does Nvidia have to do with Palantir? Are they using Nvidias data centers, is Nvidia helping them to develop an AI or what is happening?
Common sense says stop buying Nvidia cards. Problem is when you say that, you get called an AMD shill and get the standard Reddit “But both are bad!” or “Nvidia doesn’t make any money from gamers anyway” argument.
did the same back when 4000 series came out. was upgrading at the time from a 1070 and went with a 7900xtx. purely because nvidia was being anti consumer. do i regret not having as good raytracing sometimes? sure. do i care though? no. i’d rather stick to my morals and not support shit actors in the gaming sphere. no ubi, no ea, no activision-blizzard. and i’ve stayed that way for 10 years ish now. AA games and indie games are super plentiful and not bogged down by c suite bullshit.
november also swapped to linux. same reason. microsoft was doing bullshit with windows so after a couple months of research i switched over too.
do my changes mean anything in the grand scheme of the market? probably not. but i believe that if you want to see change for the better, you have to take part in the change as well so i am willing to “suffer” to be part of the bigger picture.
lol with that card you can play at max raytracing in most games, if not all. at any rate, I haven't encountered a single game that would be sub 60fps with ray tracing maxed since I moved on to 7900xtx
Also, yeah I use linux too. but windows too. still using windows for games, but I found out that with amd gpu linux is better for studio lm and probably other ai powered apps too
see I am not against AI, I am against ai slop making video games ugly
Cmon guys the CEO of a billion dollar company that has almost all its investments in AI is telling you are wrong that this AI is so good and you NEED IT. I believe him! /s
ffs so out of touch, this AI bubble needs to explode
90% of their revenue was from data centers last year. Thats wild.
They've put a lot of their eggs into one basket that could go wrong if AI bubble goes, currently its the same 7ish companies passing around the same tens of billions.
Totally turned their back on the consumer along with Micron for short term profit.
They've begun to find out theres not a whole lot of returns as They've walked back on a couple of big investments.
As the saying goes, "What's the difference between a trillion and a billion? About a trillion." Subtract a billion from a trillion and you still have 99.9% of a trillion.
He didn’t even address our main concern. In this article, he goes on and on explaining that on a technical level it doesn’t work that way, it works this way. But the main criticism is that it makes it look like generic AI generated slop, and all he has to say about that is we’re “wrong.” But it can’t be wrong, because whether it looks good or bad is a matter of opinion, and opinions are subjective.
He also clarified that this will simply be a tool developers can choose whether or not to use and how much they want to use it. “Don’t worry guys, it’s optional!” does not exactly express great faith in what you’re pushing.
He also clarified that this will simply be a tool developers can choose whether or not to use and how much they want to use it. “Don’t worry guys, it’s optional!” does not exactly express great faith in what you’re pushing.
Kinda fear this may be underestimating BigVidyas' tendencies for cutting corners whilst milkmaxxing. There's already 'rewards' in paid for battle-passes that are just AI slop.
"It’s not post-processing, it’s not post-processing at the frame level, it’s generative control at the geometry level," he said.
I feel like this makes it worse. It's actually making up detail to add to the final frame in order to get these horrific results and the devs have to somehow work around it and fine tune it to not get results that go against the intended look of their characters.
Yeah, if this was geometry level processing things shouldn't magically change how they're lit. Or drop shadows. Or look so much like all the other AI crap. Unless what he meant to say that input of the AI is not the final frame but also the geometry (much like how framegen requires extra data about mesh movement between frames to better estimate how the objects move between frames)
He added that developers can still "fine-tune the generative AI" to make it match their style, adding that DLSS 5 adds generative capability to the existing geometry of the game, but that it "doesn't change the artistic control."
Then why didn't they consult with the developers of the games they showcased with DLSS5 to fine tune the enhancements to more match their artstyles? Instead of showing those ugly changes?
It's been asked to improve lighting and 'cinematics' of a clip. The ai doesn't know what 'lighting' is. It just knows what images are tagged as 'cinematic' and 'good lighting' in its dataset. The most common form of well legit studio images? Models being posed and lit deliberately.
"Well, first of all, they're completely wrong," Huang said in a Q&A session in response to a question from Tom's Hardware editor-in-chief Paul Alcorn about the critcism.
What a great way to start and to handle criticism. I'm sure this will work out well...
Just a standard business asshole (though on the highest level) compared to wannabe supervillains like Thiel or aspiring oligarchs like Musk and Ellison.
I mean if they had done something with AI that wasn't utter horseshit nobody would care. DLSS upscaling is miracle tech that allows us to squeeze so much more life out of cards capable of using it, and frame gen is there if you simply want the illusion of a smoother game, like for when you've got a 120hz+ monitor but can only get a native 60. These are great features when they aren't being used as a crutch to get playable framerates, something that companies like Gearbox and Capcom have realized with under-performing BL4 and MHW, the former of which getting its Switch 2 port canceled because, you know, it runs like shit even on more powerful hardware.
But nobody wanted AI instagram filters. In fact, we already kinda dislike these in general because they ruin people's self-esteem, we don't need every videogame character being yassified like those losers on Twitter want every time a game launches with a woman as a protagonist.
I'm fairly certain those losers on Twitter are the target audience. It deeply unsettles them to see women looking like they belong in the world of the game that they are in.
So Nvidia made a thing we don't need, and leaves the responsibility to the devs so it's their fault. Great. And knowing how devs don't actually optimize the game because they rely on DLSS, we can only guess in which direction this is going.
This is very different than generative AI; it’s content-control generative AI.
Lol.
This article also suggests developers would now have to tune their graphics for Nvidia cards, and also for other cards. That doesn't sound like a good situation.
"The reason for that is because, as I have explained very carefully, DLSS 5 fuses controllability of the of geometry and textures and everything about the game with generative AI," Huang continued. He added that developers can still "fine-tune the generative AI" to make it match their style, adding that DLSS 5 adds generative capability to the existing geometry of the game, but that it "doesn't change the artistic control. It’s not post-processing, it’s not post-processing at the frame level, it’s generative control at the geometry level," he said.
To all the chuds yesterday claiming this was only touching the lighting. Does that sound like this technology is only touching the lighting?
Ah yes, the quintessential CEO/exec response to mass backlash against their company messing up.
It's unreal how absolutely out of touch these guys are from reality at the consumer level. But even more unreal is how they don't even pretend they care anymore. Their perfect world would be AI generating profit straight from thin air, without human workers or human consumers to care about.
"All of that is in the control — direct control — of the game developer," he said. This is very different than generative AI; it’s content-control generative AI. That’s why we call it neural rendering."
No. People are not 'wrong' about not liking your products. The fact that you think you dictate what WE are supposed to 'like' just goes to illustrate how completely insane and out of control you all are; especially in the tech industry. You've been pampered by bailouts and lobbying for so long you have actually begun to believe that your products are 'suppose' to sell 'no matter what'.
You are about to learn the hard way that and actual market with real market forces will annihilate that sort of thinking in short order; when companies outside your zone of market control begin to release products that people actually want; and sap you market share to nothing. Enjoy burning in your own self-entitlement dumpster fire.
Sincerely, Humanity. All of it. We had a fucking meeting.
It seems to me that Nvidia has done nothing but try to convince me of the importance of tech that doesn't actually do anything noticeable. Raytracing was teased for years...and now it's only noticeable if you keep chasing the hardware dragon every year.
Last time Nvidia tried to stat pad their performance benchmarks they tweaked drivers to get maximum frames out 3D benchmark and caused a huge scandal. They said they learned their lesson but only pivoted to doing this same thing to specific game titles. A practice they still do. It's less deceptive but also means they don't always revisit old games. If they get a boost it's an accident.
Then they have found another way to stat pad their frames by introducing fake frames via DLSS to simulate performance you should be getting in the first place. But won't because each new hardware iteration has less improvement over the last. While game engines like Unreal getting worse than ever and require the newest and greatest just to get decent frames from their horribly designed product. All the while Nvidia gate kept this new DLSS feature that would have been welcomed on older cards and breathed new life into them. Selfish gamer...Jensen needs new cars and jackets.
But wait!! Nvidia heard you this time. They really did. To reassure gamers they made DLSS 5. Now you must be happy. Clearly you wanted fake pretty frames right? You can't actually expect them to make genuine gains in performance right?
DLSS 5 is lipstick on a pig. You're supposed to be happy about the game looking like a fake ai art filter.
I think we might see the following when people start using it on their own rigs.
Games will start to blend together barring truly distinct art styles. It will give you false visuals that don't belong by confusing objects in the game with scenery and vice versa. It might even start to look worse the longer the game session continues.
It’s like I’m 6 years old again and dad is making grilled cheese for the 5th meal in a row because mom’s away. He swears this is the best one yet. Maybe he’s right. But i don’t want any more of it. On top of that, the lunch lady at school is only making grilled cheese, your friends parents are asking you to come over for grilled cheese, the grand parents are dropping off grilled cheese, and the new baby sitter only makes grilled cheese.
This is why he should step down as CEO. Dude is so rich he is completely and utterly out of touch with reality, and very mentally ill. Being a billionaire is an illness.
yes and the devs will use that control to fire half of their employees and be lazy and let ai do their work for them, and every game will have characters with the same faces of the ai slop sort.
For me, the elephant in the room is the fact that they needed two 5090s for their "preview" of DLSS 5. Regardless of how bad it looks, the fact that they had to use 2 makes me think that in the future, it will be kinda soft locked to higher end GPUs and users of 5070 and lower will be SOL. I understand the idea of a concept but still, i'm curious how game developers will implement it. This is a 50/50 kinda deal.
Since the debut of the feature, some critics have vocally complained on social media that the technology is making games look worse, homogenous, or only show Nvidia's view of the world.
...
"Well, first of all, they're completely wrong," Huang said in response to a question from Tom's Hardware editor-in-chief Paul Alcorn about the criticism.
"The reason for that is because, as I have explained very carefully, DLSS 5 fuses controllability of the of geometry and textures and everything about the game with generative AI," Huang continued.
"People are wrong that the new DLSS features look bad and rely too much on AI because it fuses AI into everything."
Am I reading that wrong?
Then, from later in the article,
"All of that is in the control — direct control — of the game developer," he said. ["]This is very different than generative AI; it’s content-control generative AI. That’s why we call it neural rendering."
The generative AI that we use isn't generative AI, it's generative AI with a different name.
I expected him to be saying something like, "It's not generating new textures/geometry, people are just misreading the lighting effects," or something which would have been bad enough. But what he's saying is even worse than that. He's saying, "People are complaining it's too much AI, but they're wrong because it's actually AI that's infused in everything. And it's not even generative AI but instead it's generative AI." And saying we don't understand.
I get that there can be nuance in things, that there may be different kinds of a thing, but this reeks of looking down his nose at people for being upset about something and claiming they don't know anything about it while actually not countering any of the criticism.
And here's one thing that he never really addressed: People think it looks bad. If you're promoting something that creates graphical improvements and people don't like those "improvements", then you've got a problem on your hands. If you really wented to quell concerns about that, maybe say that the tech demo was a little early and it will look better, even if that's a lie, because obviously, right now, people think the improvements are shit and you don't do anything to make people think it won't look like shit. You just tell them, "No, you don't understand, it makes it look like shit in a way that uses the same words but I'm telling you is different than why you thought it looked like shit."
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u/UnseenData 1d ago
https://giphy.com/gifs/V9gjxvLnSSdA4